Police Zerg.

[Ronniie]

Have a suggestion that will probably be instantly denied or frowned on here but I feel someone has to say something, But the current state of the server with serval main gangs gone & players dropping off left, right & centre we don't need the mass's of police there is, IMO.

So I suggest capping the police force like Whitelisted gangs are not to 25 but to a fair amount that can either attend certain crimes, dispatches or panics or just a general daily cap on the force.

More & more situations are becoming increasingly unfair unless your a squadron of 25 because police know that 1 tap of a panic button changes the course of roleplay, they have the best of kit & every resource at catching criminals without 30+ head armoured, 5.56 shooters covered by a sniper in black-hawk & MPAS. More risk assessments should be made rather than Panicking knowing it will turn into a gun fight & more investigations further enquires & so on.

Seeing far to many police not wanting 30 minutes or so's worth of Roleplay the criminals way but wanting to spend 30 minutes coughing & spluttering with NHS to then be able to finally arrest the person anyway.


Introducing a rotor or such would possible help with the mass's of police being able to roam.


Pros:
More roleplay is able to unfold.
Actually be aloud to be a criminal for more than 60 minutes.

Cons: some feds will have to wait to go out on patrol.

 

[SteveStacy]

I made a suggestion a while back about limiting the amount of police able to attend a scene and was told “It’s monitored in RP”

 

[Barry C]

I feel that the Police as a whole dont need a cap, but firearms mainly.

Possibly a cap to how many can be on duty at a time unless there is a raid or making it so they can only attend a situation when called upon, like they would in real life.

Personally, i feel that the problems lies more within the firearms part of the Police.

However i do agree in some sort of way,

+1

 

[Chilli]

Possibly a cap to how many can be on duty at a time unless there is a raid or making it so they can only attend a situation when called upon, like they would in real life

firearms command have wanted to do this for so long. But the one time firearms actually made us put our guns in the safe until needed every gang decided to start attacking police because firearms didn't have their guns. This servers meta is not like real life and can not be compared to real life procedures

 

[Barry C]

This servers meta is not like real life and can not be compared to real life procedures

Correct it is not real life, however that doesnt stop there being real life aspects brought in.

Realistically, if the firearms had to wait to be called on, they wouldnt really have to wait long would they.

Also, nothing stops the firearm officer going on duty as a normal officer until heavy firearms are needed where they can go back to the station and gear up.

 

[Ronniie]

I feel that the Police as a whole dont need a cap, but firearms mainly.

I would agree with this as there's Probie's & other lower ranking officers that still play a massive part in day to day roleplay the roads team are fun to deal with but IMO firearms needs clicking down some what to find that balance again.

But the one time firearms actually made us put our guns in the safe until needed every gang decided to start attacking police because firearms didn't have their guns.

I remember this & you'd see herd's of people around trying to crack to code but again IMO the servers at a different sort of stage now with a lot of new players & a lot of older players gone & like I said above finding the balance again on when to react & when firearms are needed, police are outnumbering the majority of other types of players so with firearms roaming three & four up to small dispatch's don't make sense regardless of meta's & irl procedures.

 

[norskov23]

police is ruining the server

 

[Custard Cream | Jay Macs]

Police win 10% of the situations we attend, we are wiped constantly and get very few situations were we actually get teh upper hand, If having a cap is the case then lets cap how many people who can have guns in the server at once to. Its a roleplay server people keep forgetting and if you are annoyed that your not winning gunfights because there is "To Many Police" You can roleplay out other avenues instead of always going for gunfights. People seem to forget its literally our job role to win situations yet we always try to go for the loss to let the other side have a win of their own and let roleplay carry out. We are Rping to and sometimes for us to enjoy ourself SOMETIMES we are allowed to get the upperhand in situations and its nice for sometimes for police to come out on top so we feel at least like we have some use.

police is ruining the server

I cant even tell if your being serious, if you are honestly mentaility like that has 0 place on the server.

I can count on one hand the past 6 months when crims have actively went for the loss to ensure we also enjoy some roleplay and have a good time, but no its always crims this crims that, there is alot of different factions in the server wanting their own stories and their own situations.

Firearms at peek times can be pretty daunting, but isnt that the point, to put the effort into stuff to find a way around that diffculty. If everything was just easy bang bang win win. Theres no point to the server, and as a response officer Firearms gives me that peace of mind that im not gonna get handsed constantly past the 6PM restart. If you want police to be nerfed I completely agree. Id be the first person to put my hand up for everyone to lose their guns other than firearms. but the rest of the server has to follow route. Unfortunately the server is going the way of Altis Life and we have to adapt. And if that means to come on stronger because some not all people are taking the piss out of us and treating us like a mere nusiance other than a police Force then these things need to change. When the days come I can finally conduct a simple traffic stop without being g checked by people for simply trying to have my own roleplay then the numbers should come down.

 

[norskov23]

I cant even tell if your being serious, if you are honestly mentaility like that has 0 place on the server.

i am being 100% serious. mentality like this is what has 0 place on the server

 

[Ronniie]

Police win 10% of the situations we attend

Let's not kid ourselves here I bet if asked there's thousands of times this year alone where police are over powering even against the 25 strong squadrons, I'm not trying to start a tit for tat against crims & feds because when you lot was getting salty about markys they was removed to keep control & fair so saying lets cap the gun flow because the police are struggling to stop abusing the position they're in

if you are annoyed that your not winning gunfights because there is "To Many Police" You can roleplay out other avenues instead of always going for gunfights

Not sure what you mean by this but this is a positive thread created to shed some light on the current state firearms are in not the countless times I've had to humble said officers! Fire arms are out of control with one in ever patrol car, its to excessive & majority of the server have a issue with it

We are Rping to and sometimes for us to enjoy ourself SOMETIMES we are allowed to get the upperhand in situations and its nice for sometimes for police to come out on top so we feel at least like we have some use.

I get that but how many high volume gun fights are you in daily which is caused by the initial presences of firearms, people are already prepared to have to have a massive gunfight to be able to rob the pharmacy or sell a bit of coke, I just think with officers like your self taking this approach is the reason firearms are so far in the thought process of i must kill everything to be the top boy in the station & not actually thinking of both sides of the fence.

Firearms at peek times can be pretty daunting

I'd agree but we don't need 30 of them on top of the 15-20 traffic police & 25 response officers companied by the 15 probie's armed with they're meat sticks.


FYI guns are harder for newer players to gain & hoard than they've ever been.

 

[Chilli]

remember this & you'd see herd's of people around trying to crack to code but again IMO the servers at a different sort of stage now

It's really not. this week alone we've probably had 4 ARV safes robbed by crimes

 

[Chilli]

I feel that the Police as a whole dont need a cap, but firearms mainly.

Also firearms already as it is already has caps mandated by management.
We can only have 40 officers (Excluding inspectors and ex police command who you see once every 6 months) of them 40. Only 8 can be CTSFOs and another 8 SFO and another 6 MOCU/Hawk (This is down from 9 it was for cts and sfos that it was last month)

the rest are the standard AFOs. So there is already a cap that does get revised by management often. It wasn't actually that long ago we got upped form 30 max to 40 max.

 

[Chilli]

Also regarding the "Police have to rules" Yes there is RP rules but I'm sure polcom would still review Ooc footage of any police zerging for the win and act accordingly. Don't think because you are committing crimes in the clip you can't ask polcom to act on it from a Ooc standpoint. Police have both Ooc and ic rules and can be punished on either base

 

[Avion Solar]

So I am going to start by saying that I don’t agree with this suggestion. As you many know I’m a police main that’s all I do and due to my current Job I am a bit limited as to when I can play. This suggestions would mean that I would be able to play even less because I might go to log on and find there’s already officers on so I may not be able to play that night. Is that really fair?

I do agree that for some situations too many officers attended them especially if its quiet and I did put in a suggestion to the Police command team a few months ago to re work the despatcher system to try encourage officers to clock on and act as a police despatcher to manage that however I don’t believe that suggestion has been taken up. I still strongly believe that the use of Police despatchers at peak times would help with the issue of too many officers responding however it does require a rework of the system in play IMO to give those officers more authority to command units on the ground.

Apologies Ronne but I believe you are wrong with what you said about “30+ head armoured, 5.56 shooters covered by a sniper in black-hawk & MPAS” As has already been stated the firearms division is capped by management at 40 officers and its very rare you see even half of them on at a time most of the time you maybe see one or two ARV’s on patrol (During my normal times anyway), the helicopter isn’t deployed as much as people believe and usually its only deployed reactively.

“More risk assessments should be made rather than Panicking knowing it will turn into a gun fight & more investigations further enquires & so on.” Personally I don’t think officers panic to turn things into a gunfight generally they do it because they feel unsafe say someone has pulled a gun on them and they need help and as such its really the person that’s making them panic id say turns it into a gunfight by opening fire when officers arrive or shooting an officer. In relation to the investigations CID do a lot of work but Its quite hard for evidence to be gathered sometimes to identify people especially with the use of local vehicles or blacked out individuals.

“Seeing far to many police not wanting 30 minutes or so's worth of Roleplay the criminals way but wanting to spend 30 minutes coughing & spluttering with NHS to then be able to finally arrest the person anyway.” Would you be able to elaborate on this because I have seen police RP a lot with criminals but recently the criminals RP appears to have been a lot of get in vehicles ram vehicles in pursuits, and then start shooting if we get caught even for small matters.

Having a read through the other comments the biggest issue appears to be towards the use of firearms by the Los Santos Police Service. Now I will say I would be the first the champion the removal of pistols from non firearms officers however that’s just not practical right now not with the level of gun violence patrol officers just would not be able to defend themselves against gangs which are lets be honest armed to the teeth. I would also be the first to champion firearms officers keeping their primary weapons in safes until they’re needed but as has already been mentioned we tried this last year and the gangs pardon my language took the piss with it so that went out the window.

If the criminals want the police to de-arm and reduce our response I believe you now have to be the ones to make the first move. We tried with the firearms safes thing last year and it was abused, you now need to make the change so we feel we can also, simple things for example:

• It’s a traffic stop don’t get all my mates to come surround the officers while they’re dealing with it
• Its pursuit don’t just start ramming police vehicles or having my mates get into local vehicles and ram officers trying to have a clean pursuit (because quite frankly I love long clean pursuits they’re a lot of fun and only when things get too risky such as the use of weapons/ ramming vehicles/ driving so dangerously someone if going to get hurt , or going for the sea will tacads authorise TC usually
• Don’t routinely carry firearms as a crim resort to knifes bats axes instead and save the firearms for something big
• Don’t turn situations into gunfights if there is a pursuit pharmacy robbery, drug deal and youre caught, try to run , fight with melee weapons, fight with fists
• If an officer does panic, roleplay it out, take them hostage, organise a ger away, run before th police arrive

Those are my thoughts on the matter

 

[Ronniie]

the rest are the standard AFOs. So there is already a cap that does get revised by management often. It wasn't actually that long ago we got upped form 30 max to 40 max.

Yeah I get that the procedures are what they are but as of right now firearms are doing the most in majority of situations & being far to heavy handed Like we've seen in the latest MPAS report just for example.

Yes there is RP rules but I'm sure polcom would still review Ooc footage

I believe they would be inundated by the volume they'd receive for it to be later forgotten or too demanding & where would the cap end & so on so raising the concern here for everyone views & opinions is more affective & I know police mains & criminals wont fully agree anywhere but to have no suggestions at all but rather postures of defence is wild.

So I am going to start by saying that I don’t agree with this suggestion.

Can always count on you to not agree with me , & I agree that it's not fair for those that work longer hours than others and those shouldn't be subject to losing out BUT capping the hours that officers are allowed to patrol for would help like, for example You are only allowed to patrol for so many hours, be in the station & do other policey things for another amount of time per week/month.
Now statics would show that yes there are only so many ARV's but we're seeing a significant rise in that and if those numbers are correct at THE CURRENT STATE of the server I'd say it was too excessive & far often than not the firearms are over powering situations.

Apologies Ronne but I believe you are wrong with what you said about “30+ head armoured, 5.56 shooters covered by a sniper in black-hawk & MPAS”

Yeah I was probably being over dramatic with this one but the point still stand's but taking away the average bobby's combat pistol isn't the answer either, I like your idea of a dispatcher to co-sign specific dispatches to relevant divisions

“Seeing far to many police not wanting 30 minutes or so's worth of Roleplay the criminals way but wanting to spend 30 minutes coughing & spluttering with NHS to then be able to finally arrest the person anyway.”

A lot of the time criminals have to be one with words in order to gain control of some situations that unfold for example; a fed that is filling up gas at the petrol station and he's approached by four armed individuals rather than following demands or participating with the crims they're staying in the grey area's with the "Should of said no panic first" or "That's protocol mate take it up with polcom" Knowing 8/10 times the report would be to petty or most not going to polcom. But if I lets say went around hands 100 feds this week and each time I approached one I said "Don't press your panic" I'd eventually be reported for fail RP & Power gaming & not to mention causing frustration within the police now if we times that by 10 and had 10 other people doing that police would eventually get annoyed as are we so it falls back down to keeping it fair & balanced again like it once has been.

Since being back I have had a few Runnings with police & each time I've chosen to roleplay rather than shoot my way around so crims are considering it but I also agree that crims can add petrol to the fire with retaliating the way most do for even simple traffic stops but that's the purpose of the thread & to highlight both parties & try & meet in the middle.
We're not asking the whole squad to be nerfed just turned down a bit that's all

 

[Ronniie]

Also firearms already as it is already has caps mandated by management.
We can only have 40 officers (Excluding inspectors and ex police command who you see once every 6 months) of them 40. Only 8 can be CTSFOs and another 8 SFO and another 6 MOCU/Hawk (This is down from 9 it was for cts and sfos that it was last month)

the rest are the standard AFOs. So there is already a cap that does get revised by management often. It wasn't actually that long ago we got upped form 30 max to 40 max.

I mean the fact of the matter is regardless of rank or how ever police works officers with AR's or to common & over powering with far to many roaming.

https://i.gyazo.com/8586504e04da8294b9ab80be5996ff13.png Even here there's three head armoured 5.56 shooters companied by Big luke g having a smoke possibly attending to drug sellers on mara turf.

(Could be missing context with that picture but could not be).

 

[Chilli]

but to have no suggestions at all but rather postures of defence is wild.

Its not a defence its just mentioning that there already is limits in place like what was mentioned somewhere in this thread.

Now statics would show that yes there are only so many ARV's but we're seeing a significant rise in that and if those numbers are correct at THE CURRENT STATE of the server I'd say it was too excessive & far often than not the firearms are over powering situations.

And rightfully so. 2 cars of firearms officers tried to speak to 2 gang members. Not even arrest we asked to speak to them.
It ended up with said gang kidnapping 5 police officers.

The reason crims think there's soo much is because they commit one crime and think "why is there so many" but that one crime was an extra crime on the already like 5 situations that require firearms assistance because even right now you mention its hard for baldies to get guns. I think my patrols themselves have probably arrested 4 baldies with new citizen ids who have a ceramic or SNS on them. It really doesn't seem to hard for someone hellbent on getting a gun to use to get a hold of one

Every night firearms command look at our "Apstra" what sets out what firearms can do and what the goal of patrol is. They wanted to lower it. Grove then kidnapped and killed a few officers. So it couldnt be lowered because there was a threat. All of the pre 6pm restart Despite only having 8 police online. They where at station what was under attack, You see only the situations you are involved in that results in the caps and authorisations.
Management and Firearms command get to see all officers situations that send intel of said situation.

TLR
You complain heavy police presense at your crime, Maybe take into account all the crimes going on at same time and rapport some groups have with police.

 

[Chilli]

(Could be missing context with that picture but could not be).

yeah you are because that was a cordon for a raid


This reinforces my point of the only situations you see are the ones you are actually involved in

police works officers with AR's or to common & over powering with far to many roaming.

So firearms who have 40 max including offline. So even if all 40 where on thats max 20 cars because we are double crewed when we can even tripple crewed so that brings us too 12 ish cars max. Is more overpowering than say TFA in at least 15 Bullet resistant champions. (There was 3 firearms cars on at the time of that scene) I fail to actually see where firearms as a number game is a problem

 

[Ronniie]

2 cars of firearms officers tried to speak to 2 gang members. Not even arrest we asked to speak to them.
It ended up with said gang kidnapping 5 police officers.

So 2 cars of firearms to speak to gang members is justifiable where? And you wonder why it ended the way it did? people are becoming tired of firearms bullshit of "We just wanted a chat mate". 2 cars brimmed with firearms officers PATROLLING should be capped or stopped & only called on when needed not for back up because traffic police can't stop a bf400 from making off (Just a example) which does happen your finding out that firearms presence is causing conflict from the get go just by being firearms for those criminals to evade arrest they now prepare for the worst we as if they was stopped by traffic the might of be hesitant towards kidnapping them & actually roleplaying in the proper manner.

The reason crims think there's soo much is because they commit one crime

It's more firearms turning up & pissing on everyone's bonfire instantly with-out letting many situations fully un-fold or letting response & other lower forms of police to deal with smaller cases for example; me, personally wouldn't care being chased, tased & nicked & all that carry for selling drugs or not stopping for police rather than having to consider a police v 25 for making off from a firearms unit.

I think my patrols themselves have probably arrested 4 baldies with new citizen ids who have a ceramic or SNS on them. It really doesn't seem to hard for someone hellbent on getting a gun to use to get a hold of one

A baldie with a SNS does not justify being popcorned by 4 or 5 firearms officers there's officers carrying pistols for that, firearms are IMO supposed to be attending the gang shoot-outs the bank heists & so on not because 1 baldies gone wild with a SNS & 45 bullets.

yeah you are because that was a cordon for a raid

I apologise for that your now re-invited to my birthday party

 

[Chilli]

So 2 cars of firearms to speak to gang members is justifiable where?

Because they wasnt at turf and spotted with a 2 handed rifle.
again stop assuming stuff you wasnt apart of this is why suggestions like this get shut down you assume

only called on when needed not for back up because traffic police can't stop a bf400 from making off

Funny one. Traffic cars would be the only ones that can keep up with a BF400 doing all sorts of mauves down alleys

if they was stopped by traffic the might of be hesitant towards kidnapping them & actually roleplaying in the proper manner

Half the time firearms leave traffic offences we turn up because traffic ask us because they Pull over lets say OCG A. OCG A then start having a few cars park across the road and up the road. So if the traffic officer wants to make an arrest to value their life they call for backup to have presence - Not our fault gangs have a ego problem and cant just leave the area when firearms presence is shown.

Like good on you for not kidnapping etc but youre 1 of 100 traffic stops and more than not someone runs the officer over or shoots them

Too prevent leaking anything currently being used as evidence. Here is an example of what happens when a response car tries to do a stop on a OCG (We still see this today)

Even our @Avion Solar has been shot up by a OCG because he warned them about window tints at a traffic stop an hour before.

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firearms are IMO supposed to be attending the gang shoot-outs

Firearms Division - Deal with any and all firearm involved incidents. -
Traffic division - Deal with traffic incidents
Response Division - Deal with what they can get their hands on because drug dealers? Probabbly on a bike so only traffic can chase. Shop robbery they can attend but if its pharmacy its probably a OCG with a full loadout
CID - Watch and report

The bigger issue is why do you see firearms so much about. Because anyone who is not firearms feels a lot more threatened when groups surround them or hang about at the scene they are trying to enjoy.

I apologise for that your now re-invited to my birthday party

What cake is it? Lemon cake?