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General Election 2019


Wilco

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You just have to look at the last nine years and make a decision based off that.It's the lesser of two evils.I for one won't be falling prey to the "lets get brexit done" facade this exceptionally cruel government is spinning. Nine years of unnecessary spending cuts and a national debt increase of 53% tells me all i need to know.

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5 minutes ago, Brandon Pigeon said:

Either way they was in power and was spending money they didnt have...  

Also good image right here (As a Joke) 

1e8d596190058367b542ce107b86694e.png 

As you can see Jeremy Corbyn is more used to pulling the wool over peoples eyes than pulling a pint.

Aha so in other words you lied and you hadn't done any research. Can't say I'm surprised tbh. 

If you were even remotely well informed on the topic you'd probably know that national debt levels under labour were fine and were actually going down slightly.

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@Xkan Not correct. Public sector net debt, adjusted for inflation, rose by 53% between 2009/10 and 2016/17. Now since the ressesion started in 2008 the debt has risen with in both hues with conservative and labour it was never "Going down slightly" either way the ressesion was reversible but the labour government finicial polices screwed this country. Yes I am a tory saying that labour messed it up Umm because its true.

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11 minutes ago, Brandon Pigeon said:

@Xkan Not correct. Public sector net debt, adjusted for inflation, rose by 53% between 2009/10 and 2016/17. Now since the ressesion started in 2008 the debt has risen with in both hues with conservative and labour it was never "Going down slightly" either way the ressesion was reversible but the labour government finicial polices screwed this country. Yes I am a tory saying that labour messed it up Umm because its true.

Public debt throughout the last labour goverment remained stagnant and went down during a couple of years up untill the financial crisis. feel free to look it up. 

The problem with saying that labours finacial policies screwed the country a whole DECADE later is that it's entirely baseless, show me any evidence to support your claim.

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I have to agree with @Xkan here, if you do some real research you’ll find that the last time Labour were in charge the economy was actually doing pretty well, but due to the global financial crisis it fucked a lot of countries up. This was no fault of Labour and actually if it wasn’t for how labour handled it, our economy would have been a lot more worse off now. The whole “Labour caused all of this and ruined our economy” narrative is literally just something the tories ran with to misinform the public and gain power. If you google this then there’s a lot of different sources to back this up. (https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/may/18/labour-economic-crisis-tories - this is just one of the first results, I’m on phone so cba to post multiple links, but seriously google it).


Are you not a BTP officer @Brandon Pigeon? Do you genuinely think our police services and NHS can survive more years of cuts? 
 

This whole “Get brexit done” charade is just bullshit as well, the fact that people are voting Tory simply because of Brexit is absurd. It’s also madness that most of these people think we’d just leave in January and that’s the end of it, without realising Brexit will still be going on for years, we will not have a solid trade deal for a good while and if we turn to the US for our main point of trade then we’re fucked. That’s where stuff like the NHS being sold off will happen. If you genuinely believe Boris Johnson wouldn’t be willing to sell off our NHS to get a trade deal with USA then I just don’t know what to say anymore. In the trade talks, US will hold all the cards and if we want a trade deal, we’d have no choice but to accept. The only way I see trade with the USA being economically viable for us is if Bernie becomes the new president, DT will fuck us over for a deal that primarily benefits them over us.

 

A lot of your points seem to be common misinformation spread by Tory media and supporters. I fancy our chances with Labour under a fully costed and backed manifesto rather than the Torys who can’t even cost theirs. 
 

It’s 5:30am and I’ve got work soon but if I’ve made any mistakes I’ll go back through and correct them when I’m more awake in a few hours.

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3 minutes ago, Rice Krispy said:

Are you not a BTP officer @Brandon Pigeon? Do you genuinely think our police services and NHS can survive more years of cuts? 

I Fully understand where you are coming from however I do come from a family who has always voted tory, however It does not change the point that both parties have some very convincing projections of what they think they can and cannot do... Im not throwing labour under the bus as such but I do believe that with what I have seen and heard (Note mostly tory media like the telegraph) but I personally feel like the tories are being more reasonable.  

As for the Police and NHS I cannot speak on the NHS's behalf but as for the police I can tell you that It mostly affects home office forces, as 95% of our funding comes from the train operating companines themselves. However I have seen first hand my local police force Devon and Cornwall struggling as they have such a large ammount of land to cover and is one of the smallest forces (By Number of Constables) It is a real issue however for BTP funding really isnt an issue @Rice Krispy But does not mitigate the fact that funding is a huge issue across all services Police,Millitary,NHS,Fire&R 

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Personally I will be voting for Conservatives 🌳🌳🇬🇧🇬🇧 today, for many reasons.

Business

As someone who works for a relatively medium sized business as well as having most the families income come from owning a business I find it absurd that Labour want increase corporation tax to 26% as well as increasing dividend tax. What they effectively are doing is taking money from people who may only have small corner shop, 1 man plumbing business etc.. This tax will there mean all these small business will have less cash to pay their staff/ the owner resulting in lower living standards. ( Also the fact of increasing minimum wage to £10 an hour, good luck to the corner shop wanting to employ part time students etc, not going to be able to afford it).

Security

It is widely known that Jeremy Corbyn has sympathised with many of Britain's enemies. Support the IRA, wants to give second chances to mass terrorist murders. In the event of Labour getting into power Diane Abbot will become Home Secretary. She has called for MI5 to be disbanded due to it being a conspiracy (Despite it stopping over 100 potential attacks this year), has no grasp on numbers or policing, when a major report on terrorism was released she didn't even read it and when questioned on it she tried lying that she had in fact read it. Of this doesn't make you even in the slightest way nervous about security then....

NHS

This has become a major talking point from Labours side the repeated message 'Tories will sell off the NHS to Trump'. I think people should take a look back at the history of the NHS.

NHS was introduced shortly after WW2. The bill was supported by both parties and both had on their manifestos to create if they got into power. Labour got into power so they were the ones who initially started it up.

7.7% of the NHS is currently privatised, with 4.4% of that being Labour who privatised it. They introduced PFI, sold off hospitals to private owners which now costs the tax payers billions everyear to use. It is ludicrous to think that probably our most treasured institution should be sold off and Trump & Boris have repeatedly said it's not for sale!

People talk about the price of drugs and that they will go up when we do trade deals with the USA. Labour have been saying it will cost is £28billion more every year. This is a complete and utter scaremongering fact. This value is if we were to pay the same price for drugs that the bowl person would in America + telling everywhere else in the world we buy drugs from that we will pay them more and equivalent to USA prices. It is a complete project fear.

Debt/Deficit

I think it is important to understand what these 2 things mean and why one is arguably more important than the other.

Debt - How much the government is borrowing everyear to cover public services.

Defect - The difference between amount of money raised through taxes and how much is required on public services.

The idea is to reduce the deficit so that the county can become 'self-working' without the need to borrow cash. If you look at the time conservatives have been in power they have dramatically reduced the deficit even though they have cut taxes in different places, increased personal allowance etc... This can only be down with a strong dynamic market economy.

Brexit

I was too young at the time to have a vote in the referendum but I would have voted leave. If find it incredibly undemocratic to campaign to revoke or ask for a second referendum on something that hasn't even happened yet.

We were all told that at the point we vote to leave the EU we will be plunged into a deep economic crisis, a recession will happen. Not one of those things happened.

Business is still in eating in the UK, just yesterday Aston Martin opened up there new factory to build 2 new models of cars. It has become an easy scapegoat for companies to say 'We can't pay you due to brexit'. It's a nice get out to deflect from the actual reason something might have failed.

Immigration was probably the biggest reason everyone voted to leave. Open door immigration allows people who have no skills to enter the country, eventually claiming benefits etc... Labour want to open this free movement to the WHOLE world. Absurd. It puts stress on our public services like the NHS. We can't keep up funding/a good service if population growth is at 500,000 every single year. As shown in the EU elections few months ago, Brexit' party secured the most seats, telling you something about the mindset of the country.

I could probably write something about every topic but I might be here a whole so I will summarise with some key points and let you look into some claims:

Labour have:

- Introduced NHS privitisation, 2003

- Started an illegal war, 2003

- Started private finance and sold off a hospital, 2003&2009

- Scrapped student grants, 1998

- Approved Grenfell cladding, 2007

- Funded bank bailout, 2008

- Started disability assesments, 2008

- Forced Windrush generation into checks, 2009

- Announced bedroom tax, 2008

- Legalised zero hour contracts, 1999

- Built 3000 council homes in 13 years

- Handed powers to the EU in the Lisbon treaty resulting In Brexit.

 

These are my views coupled with hard facts. I hope people don't get clouded in the vision of having free wifi, free everything tbh and understand that it is British business that ultimately allows our country to work. There is one party that is on the side of business.

Vote Conservative 🌳🇬🇧🌳🇬🇧

All debate welcome

 

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   George Harris

The Firm | Executive Director

2017 - - 2022

 Level 4 Staff Member   FiveM Developer    Ex-Altis Capo/Doctor/CI

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12 hours ago, John Fletcher said:

I'll be turning up to one, as it's at my college, but I will not be casting my vote. 

If you vote for smaller parties the bigger parties may change some of their policies to please the masses. You need to vote lol. If you don’t you have legit 0 say in any political matters for the next 5 years because you didn’t even try to fix it

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1 hour ago, Felix - Yello said:

If you vote for smaller parties the bigger parties may change some of their policies to please the masses. You need to vote lol. If you don’t you have legit 0 say in any political matters for the next 5 years because you didn’t even try to fix it

100% agree

 

I've voted Labour 🌹

If I had the opportunity to vote for in the brexit referendum I would have vote to remain, the entire campaign for the leave side was misleading and prayed on reminiscing on a bygone era. Alongside leaving our country in a potential economic disaster under what has been analysed by the bank of england and foundations specialised in the area, this regarding a no deal scenario. However you can not go back and change an entire country's initial decision, my hope now is for an ideal trade deal. Preferably staying within the European single market.

I think Corbyn is dangerous to have in power due to his foreign policy however he's the lesser of two evils in my eyes. And I'm voting for the policies not the people.

Dodgy Dave and Farage are bellsniffs. Opinions hurt.

 

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2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

NHS was introduced shortly after WW2. The bill was supported by both parties and both had on their manifestos to create if they got into power. Labour got into power so they were the ones who initially started it up.

This one needs checking George the conservatives actually voted against the creation of a national health service throughout the initial planning phases it even divided the labour cabinet alot of politicians at this time actually didn't want nor actually thought the NHS was going to be a success

 

2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Funded bank bailout, 2008

The global financial crash of 2008 has absolutely nothing to do with the labour government and had the conservatives been in power at the time they to would have had to bail out the banks it would have made no difference.As someone who actually lost everything in the collapse I laugh everytime someone mentions this.It had nothing to do with the government.

2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

- Announced bedroom tax, 2008

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bedroom_tax i'll just leave this here George Yes the initial idea was floated by labour but was not actually inacted by them that was the tories.

 

2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Approved Grenfell cladding

that's just a lie mate it was approved by the royal borough of Kensington and Chelsea councils planning department (a conservative council)

 

2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Legalised zero hour contracts, 1999

Again yes legailized by labour but the system has been notoriously abused by employers since it's introduction and was never intended to be used as it is now.

 

2 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Scrapped student grants, 1998

Good.At 18 you legally become an adult if you decide as an adult to stay in education for a further 3-5 years be prepared to put your hand in your pocket and pay for it.I started my degree at 23 and never once complained about having to pay for it.Comparatively our higher education costs are still well below the global average. 

 

You mention immigration laws and how labour want a free movement policy it's been proventime and time again immigration stimulates economies it doesn't stunt them.Free movement with the working sector is vital to economic growth and is something that should be praised not seen as "them comin over ere and stealin our jobs and claimin our benefits"

 

It's your choice to vote for who you want to vote for I'm making my choice based off of the fact my wife who works in the public sector has not received an increase in pay for the last 9 years.Just let that sink in.inflation has gone up year on year and her wages have not increased to cover the extra cost of living,shes seen cuts to her department of 62% and the work load increase an additional 36%.Why not go get a better job i hear you ask?She investigates benefit fraud not a huge call for that in the private sector.I have witnessed what tory austerity cuts are doing to this country all the while giving big business massive tax breaks and slashingpublic services so these companies can hide profits off shore and pay out massive bonuses to its sexecutives.They have increased the national debt by 53% (thats the borrowing they have to do to make up shortfalls they've had to borrow more because they cut corporation tax,the corporations aw this and used loopholes to hide profits and this pay no tax on them)

Brexit is a scam I've said this from the day they announced a referendum on it.It's funny we started the brexit debate right about the time the EU announced plans to bring in tax haven laws to compel people to declare and pay tax on any offshore holdings they have.

I live in the north east as always the hardest hit when it comes to government spending cuts I've seen industries decimated and communites ruined due to tory cuts and austerity.

For my own sanity i can't live another five years like this.

This cruel government has done nothing for the working man over the last nine years except take from him and give nothing in return.

this is the tory mindset

Police Fire and Ambulances? who needs those slash them.

Spend money on schools?tosh they'll just have to make do with what they've got besides they can always just ask the childrens parents to pay for books.

NHS funding?hur hur well labour sold off a small percentage of  the health care system lets use that as a excuse to cronically underfund them.

Youth services? libraries? Bah don't need those cut them.

Wait Targuins got a chinese businessman with $5billion sitting in an offshore account and he wants to buy up a bunch of commerical properties and leave them vacant so he can use them as a tax boone?Set up a meeting we must listen to what this man has to say of course he won't actually be paying tax but a nice donation to the party wouldn't go unnoticed.

 

Labour is not perfect not by a long shot.But as a traditonally conservative voter I just cannot bring myself to vote for this government in it's current form.It's cruel,evil and does not give a fuck about you.

 

 

 

 

 

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6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

It is widely known that Jeremy Corbyn has sympathised with many of Britain's enemies. Support the IRA, wants to give second chances to mass terrorist murders.

"Wants to give second chances to mass terrorist murderers" When has he ever said this? 

Also the logic you're applying to when something good is done by labour "It was supported by both parties but labour were just in power at the time" but if it's something negative that BOTH the parties supported it's "Labour made this terrible decision" I don't want to personally call you out but it does come off as very hypocritical.
 

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Trump & Boris have repeatedly said it's not for sale!

Ah yes, reknown truth tellers Donald Trump and Boris Johnson lmao. Trump when asked if the NHS was on the table for a trade deal said "Everything is on the table, everything" or something along the lines of that, he backtracked on it later as he realised it could potentially hurt his biggest political ally in the UK, I'd say you'd be downright gullible to believe he wouldn't try to buy parts of the NHS after the election.

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

People talk about the price of drugs and that they will go up when we do trade deals with the USA. Labour have been saying it will cost is £28billion more every year. This is a complete and utter scaremongering fact. This value is if we were to pay the same price for drugs that the bowl person would in America + telling everywhere else in the world we buy drugs from that we will pay them more and equivalent to USA prices. It is a complete project fear.

Scaremongering fact? You're making it sound like a number that was made up on the spot when infact that number was taken from a study conducted by a thinktank that was funded by the Economic and Social Research Council. You know... people that are actually educated and informed on the matter. 
 

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Brexit

I was too young at the time to have a vote in the referendum but I would have voted leave. If find it incredibly undemocratic to campaign to revoke or ask for a second referendum on something that hasn't even happened yet.

We were all told that at the point we vote to leave the EU we will be plunged into a deep economic crisis, a recession will happen. Not one of those things happened.

Business is still in eating in the UK, just yesterday Aston Martin opened up there new factory to build 2 new models of cars. It has become an easy scapegoat for companies to say 'We can't pay you due to brexit'. It's a nice get out to deflect from the actual reason something might have failed.

Immigration was probably the biggest reason everyone voted to leave. Open door immigration allows people who have no skills to enter the country, eventually claiming benefits etc... Labour want to open this free movement to the WHOLE world. Absurd. It puts stress on our public services like the NHS. We can't keep up funding/a good service if population growth is at 500,000 every single year. As shown in the EU elections few months ago, Brexit' party secured the most seats, telling you something about the mindset of the country.

You find it undemocratic to have a second referendum even though the leave that's on the table now was not even close to the leave that was being promised by any politician that advocated for it during the weeks coming up the referendum? I'd argue it's far more undemocratic to not allow people to change their minds now that they have a much better impression of what Brexit might look like if it was to go through on the current terms. Nigel Farage himself said that there'd be need for a second referendum incase of a 52-48 result a couple of weeks before the referendum happened but that's null and void now that leave won I'm assuming? Keep in mind many people voiced their regrets over voting leave as they were clearly lied to and had no idea what they were voting for (a couple of people I personally know voted and supported leave and now heavily regret it) and now want a second referendum. 
 

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

We were all told that at the point we vote to leave the EU we will be plunged into a deep economic crisis, a recession will happen. Not one of those things happened.


Probably because you haven't left yet? lol 
But it's an undeniable fact that the UK has already suffered economically just from the result of the vote but you're still convinced that nothing negative is going to happen after you actually leave? 97 percent of economists, the CBI, HM treasury and just about everysingle reliable economic study and forecast and has concluded that brexit under current terms would damage the UK's economy severely but you're just not convinced it's true because why? 
 

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

As shown in the EU elections few months ago, Brexit' party secured the most seats, telling you something about the mindset of the country.

You forgot to mention that remain leaning parties won about 53-54 percent of the seats against pro brexit parties winning around 46-47 percent? If anything surely it shows the country's will to remain in the EU. 
 

6 hours ago, George-Harris said:

Immigration was probably the biggest reason everyone voted to leave. Open door immigration allows people who have no skills to enter the country, eventually claiming benefits etc... Labour want to open this free movement to the WHOLE world. Absurd. It puts stress on our public services like the NHS. We can't keep up funding/a good service if population growth is at 500,000 every single year.

It kinda hurts to see how painfully uninformed people are when it comes to immigration and what it brings to your country. Multiple studies have shown that the UK has benefitted tremendously from immigration over the past couple of decades, even if there were people leeching off the system there'd be more than enough hard working people to compensate for it. 


I'll be honest, it is genuinely really disappointing to see people fall for the Tory leaderships continious lies.

Edited by Xkan
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3 hours ago, Felix - Yello said:

If you vote for smaller parties the bigger parties may change some of their policies to please the masses. You need to vote lol. If you don’t you have legit 0 say in any political matters for the next 5 years because you didn’t even try to fix it

While I believe what you're saying, I have no stand point in politics. There is no point in choosing a party I firmly don't agree with and with the majority of politics, I don't know anything about it. It's essentially playing in a minefield. 

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Labour is a stupid concept:

Charge the people who have earned their money well and fair.

Charge private schools tax, which will lead to a big loss of students and multiple possibilities of private schools shutting down.

Also when the wealthy people start to get taxed more they will end up leaving the country and probably go to a country whose aim isn't to become fully communist.

Yeah free unis and broadband is all good, but think of the consequences and think were the money will actually come from and how it will drain out very quickly. They will just print money, decrease the value of the pound and ruins the UK even more.

Image result for labour memes

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On 12/12/2019 at 19:34, Fergu said:

Labour is a stupid concept:

Charge the people who have earned their money well and fair.

Charge private schools tax, which will lead to a big loss of students and multiple possibilities of private schools shutting down.

Also when the wealthy people start to get taxed more they will end up leaving the country and probably go to a country whose aim isn't to become fully communist.

Yeah free unis and broadband is all good, but think of the consequences and think were the money will actually come from and how it will drain out very quickly. They will just print money, decrease the value of the pound and ruins the UK even more.

Image result for labour memes

Firstly, Hitler never said that. I'd seriously encourage you to stop believing any quote you see on the internet. Secondly, the idea that all money you earn espicially if you're ultra rich like the ones Corbyn wants to tax is all "Fairly earned" is just naivity at it's finest. 

Jeff Bezos earns in around 10 mins what his average employee would earn 60 years of working full time, He earns around as much in 10 seconds as his average employee earns a year. 
If you think that's justifiable and fair by any stretch of the imagination then you're simply out of touch with reality. 

Taxing the wealthiest more instead of letting them horde extreme amounts of wealth in order to accomodate for the less fortunate isn't communism by any stretch of the imagination. Corbyn wants to implement systems used by the countries that currently have the highest living standards in the world by almost every measurement but when he tries to implement it in one of the biggest economies in the world "It's unrealistic and madness" 

As for the free broadband suggestion, it's been suggested that it could boost the economy through improved infrastructure. Investing money into the public isn't throwing money away, it's called an investment for a reason.

Edited by Xkan
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“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples’ money.”

"In my right-wing politics of the time, I held that unemployment was usually the fault of the unemployed."

"How do you tell a communist? Well, it's someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an anti-Communist? It's someone who understands Marx and Lenin."

"The problem is not that people are taxed too little, the problem is that government spends too much."

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2 hours ago, Xkan said:

Taxing the wealthiest more instead of letting them horde extreme amounts of wealth in order to accomodate for the less fortunate isn't communism by any stretch of the imagination.

It’s not just the wealthiest m8 for example my parents started of with absolutely nothing and had to work there way up by working extremely hard, my mum works a full time job as well as looking after 3 kids and my dad works for weeks usually and get maybe 1 week off in the major holidays like Christmas and summer. They do not deserve to have that hard work destroyed cause they want their children to go to a good school.

Also personally it would be against my morals to support someone who openly supports Hamas and anti-semitism 

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