Mandatory situations for gangs to be wearing their gang colors.

[VeikkQ]

Hardly any realism behind forcing people to wear gang clothes

Same can be said for gangs having assault rifles and guns not very UK them anymore  but it is a video game we are meant to have fun in it. 


So we can make it Knife crime again,  or we can continue discussion WHEN SHOULD GANGS wear THEIR CLOTHING. 

 

[Raj]

Aight, I'll make it short. Unless you got anything relevant to the suggestion, then refrain from typing it. This is not a argument about last night situation. @EXXPiRED@Tommy_TV2021@bmav@SoggyWafe@Haza @PJ Adams

If you gents continue arguing, warning points will be given, the same goes for forum restrictions. This is a suggestion, so unless you got anything to add in regards to the situation, refrain from typing it. If you feel like police are abusing their powers, pass it to Police command / Staff, or make a report. Simple as.

I've tried to keep everything I have said in line with the suggested rule change tbh. Point still stands, police have tools at their disposal to identify they should use this rather than forcing gangs to wear colours to make it easy to arrest/raid  

 

[PJ Adams]

Same can be said for gangs having assault rifles and guns not very UK them anymore  but it is a video game we are meant to have fun in it. 


So we can make it Knife crime again,  or we can continue discussion WHEN SHOULD GANGS wear THEIR CLOTHING. 

Maybe you should listen to snuffles and keep it related to the post. 

 

[Raj]

Same can be said for gangs having assault rifles and guns not very UK them anymore  but it is a video game we are meant to have fun in it. 


So we can make it Knife crime again,  or we can continue discussion WHEN SHOULD GANGS wear THEIR CLOTHING. 

Plenty of UK gangs have guns, maybe not assault rifles - maybe assault rilfes should be removed from the game also.

But back to the point, Gangs should be wearing clothing around the city BUT NOT be forced to have to keep this clothing on when committing serious offences, idk if voices can be used for identification but like I said 100 times before use other tools the police have to identify rather than making any serious crime pointless to commit if it will always result in your gang being raided.

 

[VeikkQ]

Plenty of UK gangs have guns, maybe not assault rifles - maybe assault rilfes should be removed from the game also.

But back to the point, Gangs should be wearing clothing around the city BUT NOT be forced to have to keep this clothing on when committing serious offences, idk if voices can be used for identification but like I said 100 times before use other tools the police have to identify rather than making any serious crime pointless to commit if it will always result in your gang being raided.

Voice it depends. I mean x situations like mass gunfight in Altis people keep gang clothing on so we would RDM random civ, same goes for here. If you are mass shooting it would help some random civ getting shot at situations. 

 

[Paru]

Plenty of UK gangs have guns, maybe not assault rifles - maybe assault rilfes should be removed from the game also.

But back to the point, Gangs should be wearing clothing around the city BUT NOT be forced to have to keep this clothing on when committing serious offences, idk if voices can be used for identification but like I said 100 times before use other tools the police have to identify rather than making any serious crime pointless to commit if it will always result in your gang being raided.

Voices cannot be used to ID but they can be used for the purpose of an investigation, a few of our "tools" have been mentioned above but not the limitations we have regarding them, ANPR? Gotta be in a car for that, PNC? Won't work on local cars, NPAS? Gotta be an NPAS pilot (A sub unit of Spec Ops) and mandatory double crewing at all times as well, the tools we have currently have severe limitations to them all for the fairness and balance of the server, this is a balance related suggestion in order for us to not be so limited with our options

 

[Raj]

Voice it depends. I mean x situations like mass gunfight in Altis people keep gang clothing on so we would RDM random civ, same goes for here. If you are mass shooting it would help some random civ getting shot at situations. 

Then wearing colours to show you are in a gang, then cant be used to put sanctions on a gang for what ever happened in RP you would have to ignore that fact you can see what colour clothing they are wearing because all you want to do is make sure you dont shoot a random civ..?

 

[Amon Long]

Honestly I feel like alot of shit shit would be avoided if stuff for examples like guns and the stuff needed to make ammunition weren't so hard to come by for gangs but completely free with no consequence of loosing them for police 

There is where the unbalance lies it can be very time consuming just to be able to afford to buy one gun and some ammo for some people just for cops to be able to not value their equipment as much as we are forced too with the only real value of their life being they can't return to a situation for 10 minutes 

Not only that everyone gangs and police are too quick to shoot instead of see where the potential roleplay experience could go 

And unfortunately we are all reactive to past experiences with the opposing force making us judge all scenarios on the negative ones we've had and react quickly because we think the other person is going to react quickly and negatively causing like I say gangs to act violently to protect the stuff they have to put so much work in for because in the blink of an eye it can be taken from them resulting in hours of grinding just to get it back and potentially have the same thing happen again and police have to sit out on the naughty step for 10 minutes in that 10 minutes going to the armory getting a nice free gun with all the trimmings a load of ammo and a load of body armor costing them little to nothing 

 

[Tigerforce]

I understand what the gangs are saying whereby if they are forced to wear gang clothing it makes it easier for police and make it difficult to commit serious crimes as a gang. I understand it also from a police perspective whereby if we attend a situation we don't want to go in thinking one 1 gang member is involved just to later find out numerous gangs are involved.  So here's my personal view on the matter.

Am going to split my response into 2 sections:

Gang Serious crimes

If you are committing a crime on behalf of the gang itself i.e. Drivebys / mass shootings / PD attacks and stuff like that then yes I believe it's fair for you to wear colours as these incidents would involve many people and you run the high risk of RDM (Primarily due to people's stupidity of staying in the area). Now with that being said I understand gangs might be against this however if you are committing a crime on BEHALF of the gang why wouldn't you want to wear gang colours to represent it. 

The advantage to this would be no matter if they person wasn't initially there if they are wearing colours they can just come and get involved in addition to lowering the risk of RDM and actually having a clue what the situation is + how many people are actually involved so EVERYONE can better valuing their lives and finally add a deterrent to long drawn out gunfights as the longer the gunfight goes on the higher chance police will gather more evidence OR even see what gang that is actually doing it.

The disadvantages for this would be that it would make police lives easier and know who had done it in addition to opening the gang to retaliations.

Individual serious crimes

Now on the flip side if you are committing a crime for your own benefit such as Personal OR Revenge killing / robberies / Hostage takings then no i don't believe you should have to wear your gang colours for that as at that point its for personal gain NOT gang. 

The advantages for this would be people could commit serious crimes alone and not have to worry about gangs getting the blame and also allows those not wanting to be involved in current gang situations to do their own thing.

The disadvantages however would be knowing those who are already present and visible are the only ones who can get involved in addition to losing your gang's assistance.

Overall I say all of this as currently you have every gang member coming out of colours and just getting involved with there being no way to actually determine how many are involved so people can actually value their lives and prevent the risk of RDM. My view comes similar to the off duty system whereby once you are off duty (OR for this suggestion Out of colours) you lose all abilities and advantages in addition to being on your own in situations.

 

[Masis]

Same can be said for gangs having assault rifles and guns not very UK them anymore  but it is a video game we are meant to have fun in it. 


So we can make it Knife crime again,  or we can continue discussion WHEN SHOULD GANGS wear THEIR CLOTHING. 

Then again the same can be said for the police no?

I personally find it very sad to see when 7 cop cars and 1 interceptor chase a taxi that went trough a red light, to chase him for 2 minutes to then decide to cut the fun off already and TC the living shit out of him.

I see this happening all the time, happened to me too all the time even tho I am clearly not posing a threat whatsoever. It’s almost impossible to get away and I feel like a lot of cops just want to end the situation instantly so there is no room for a good chase, that can actually be very fun.

Let alone what would happend to me if I would be in my gang colors getting chased, I would get rammed to Jupiter within the first minute of the chase.

(personal opinion)

 

[VeikkQ]

Then again the same can be said for the police no?

I personally find it very sad to see when 7 cop cars and 1 interceptor chase a taxi that went trough a red light, to chase him for 2 minutes to then decide to cut the fun off already and TC the living shit out of him.

I see this happening all the time, happened to me too all the time even tho I am clearly not posing a threat whatsoever. It’s almost impossible to get away and I feel like a lot of cops just want to end the situation instantly.

Let alone what would happend if I would be in my gang colors, I would get rammed back to Jupiter within the first minute of the chase.

(personal opinion)

Again I agree that TC auth is pretty shit some times for CIV since it is couple hit and  you are out. Different story if drive like crazy man and cause serious injury to suspect, those things can be change with police rules and with Devs, change how cars broke down.  I agree with since I try it get some cancel pursuit with causing as much dangerous to other road user aa I could did not  work. 

But it completely different discussion.   End of day everything need have balance on it.  I do agree with you TC might be auth. for gangs bit too easily but everything depends on situation.  I think discussion should be when to wear it when not. What we are pretty far away now. 

 

[Tigerforce]

Then again the same can be said for the police no?

I personally find it very sad to see when 7 cop cars and 1 interceptor chase a taxi that went trough a red light, to chase him for 2 minutes to then decide to cut the fun off already and TC the living shit out of him.

I see this happening all the time, happened to me too all the time even tho I am clearly not posing a threat whatsoever. It’s almost impossible to get away and I feel like a lot of cops just want to end the situation instantly.

Let alone what would happend if I would be in my gang colors, I would get rammed back to Jupiter within the first minute of the chase.

(personal opinion)

I dont understand the relevence here not going to lie. The suggestion is should gangs wear colours during "Gangs taking part in deliverate active situations must be wearing their gang clothing, not civilian clothing."

Regarding TCs if you have a complaints file it.

Regarding the 7 vehicles pursuits they is a 5 vehicle rule pursuit with a few exceptions

 

[Masis]

I dont understand the relevence here not going to lie. The suggestion is should gangs wear colours during "Gangs taking part in deliverate active situations must be wearing their gang clothing, not civilian clothing."

Regarding TCs if you have a complaints file it.

Regarding the 7 vehicles pursuits they is a 5 vehicle rule pursuit with a few exceptions

The relevance is that the majority of people are already getting “overpowered” by the police when they are so to say “out of colors”, let alone what would happen to them if they are wearing their gang insignia and then do something, that’s the point I am trying to explain.

What I wrote above was merely a example to explain why I would go out of colors myself to do something and why I personally do not think this rule would work in the current state of the server whatsoever. (from both sides)

 

[Nuclear]

I dont think limiting gangs to their specific gang clothing is a good idea and will limit a lot and turn into how arma was.

On the other hand however gangs right now seem to think taking their identifiying clothes off and never proclaiming their a part of a gang can just roll up and KOS people with fuck all said if even anything is okay, which is of course RDM, so that should be slapped down by gang leads...

Personal opinion

 

[Croam]

My stance on this topic is there is a reason why gang members are out of colors as for me, When I'm in full gang attire and police see me its a way different interaction with them. If I am in full Azteca blue colors police tend to be more aggressive and push for stopping/searching me.

There is also the whole if police see any sort of crime happening in colors it leads to a case of getting raided because you've ID for being affiliated. There is the option of changing clothing why not use it to benefit it. Gangs do crime yes do we wanna easily get caught by wearing bright colors to be easily identified by police when doing crime. (Its police job to identify whos a threat at any scenario they are at) Any scene police are in they need to be sure of who and what they are against and be on look out for anything at the scene.

at all fairness police need to realize the points of criminal life. Getting raided/Arrested hurts a criminal character. As a criminal at least for me I value my assets and want to avoid any sort of run in with the police. 

 

[JB_]

There isn’t really an upside to this suggestion for the server as a whole and all I can see coming from this is…

well the people who committed XX crime were in purple so let’s stop and search all ballas tonight or let’s raid this safe or that house. 
All that does in turn is force people to avoid  crim RP because they spend the rest of the day with empty pockets or out of colours anyway not representing their gang. 
 

gangs 3rd partying RP scenarios that take away from the RP of the situation should be handled by staff or reports. You might have more chance with a suggestion for a rule change around RP being ruined by a 3rd party, imo 3rd party involvement should enhance an RP scenario or add something and not take away from the situation as a whole. I personally have been pulled by an admin for 3rd partying a situation… although it’s not a rule, a discussion was still had about how the RP was ruined or altered by my actions and tbh this should be something people can be banned for if the reasoning is valid enough - but that’s case by case and requires on site admin spectatorship. 
To be honest I personally choose to do whatever I’m doing while in yellow be that pharmacies or just generally robbing people because I’m confident enough I’m my storage units etc that the repercussions will be minimal but you can’t force everyone to have that attitude. Especially with things like car scraps and longer sentences being encouraged. 
Without referencing individual situations too much it really is on the police to ensure they are safe in their duties. There are so many ways this can be done. 

- vehicles on scene? Assign someone to grab plates, you don’t need a car for this you can look them up later and just actually look at plates.

- wide open area? NPAS, Road blocks, officers in high spots over looking. You don’t need all 20 officers eyes on directly with a situation guns drawn, better on scene planning can help. 
 

if these options aren’t available such as no pilots etc then you basically aren’t well equipped enough for the situation and this is when it comes back to intel gathering. Set up further away, see who leaves see where they go and assess for another time. 

 

[Melondwarf]

Just my two cents; isn't the point of gang colours that you actually show them? What's the point in having gang colours/gang specific melee weapons if you're so concerned about being identified as a gang affiliate?

Do I agree with "you need to rep gang colours whenever you commit a crime"? No....but as NHS, far too often I come up to gang related incidents where the person isn't identifiable as a gang member until the crew rocks up. Maybe cops would be less trigger happy if not every single civ around them can potentially be a gang member in civvy colours out to blast their head off.

If you want to be in a gang and be one of the cool kids, at least put on the big boy pants and represent your gang

 

[HyperG1]

I'm all for this, ESPECIALLY after last night, out of colour gang members stabbing/shooting police with no valid RP at all, it's RDM at the end of the day, in fact a player report that was declined recently against Ponty was declined on that basis, that the gentlemen who robbed him was an out of colours Triad but every other triad in colours got involved, same principle here. If you're getting involved in situations that are going to/could turn into a firefight or similar crimes, WEAR COLOURS, even Police have to wear full PPE etc with such situations, I know why this has been downvoted so badly, because it's the gangs assuming it's the "Police only want to win" mentality, it's not, it's unfair and unbalanced to be involved in situs like last night whilst out of colours. 

Agree with you there, this is a constant problem ( gangs love having the name/turf/perks but love to not use the uniform. They change clothes so much kill people thinking bad boys but then when they get rolled its an instant NVL RDM cry cry cry when it suits them. plain and simple big gangs play everything to their advantage. Civilians just got to follow suit these days.

 

[Stavik]

This has a negative vote count, but can be discussed in the future.
Obervations as off right now is that this still occur, but its up to each induvidual players to make sure things are right before situations escalate.

RP Would need to be provided.