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Taking The Police Hostage (Important)
- Thread starter Wilco
- Start date
- Status
meow
Well-known member
- Location
- Oxford
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Sammm
Well-known member
- Location
- Manchester
I think I was on one of the operations you were referring to. We did try to bargain with them, but they wanted too much and we had confirmed the number of suspects, and we had the correct positions to take them all down in a few seconds.
Jimmyy
Well-known member
- Location
- Weston-Super-Mare
Did you get all of them in one quick burst?
If not then the hostages would have died and that is the real aim for the police.
puppy1004
Richest Kavala Hobo
- Location
- The Netherlands
Okay, first this is not the place to discuss this. Second, I have been popo myself so I know what I am talking about 
Best solution:
Get more AR, why? Because they have the balls and the guns to stand up to rebels. I know it's a hard life as a rebel but keep in mind the quantity of trolls the police get on a daily basis(90%) after a while it becomes hard to see the difference(For most popo), this is nobody's fault. Reduce the amount of hobo's and enjoy the fucking game. Yes, zafirs were nice weapons but they require no skill. Let's ALL roleplay better and everything will be fine.
Best solution:
Get more AR, why? Because they have the balls and the guns to stand up to rebels. I know it's a hard life as a rebel but keep in mind the quantity of trolls the police get on a daily basis(90%) after a while it becomes hard to see the difference(For most popo), this is nobody's fault. Reduce the amount of hobo's and enjoy the fucking game. Yes, zafirs were nice weapons but they require no skill. Let's ALL roleplay better and everything will be fine.
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Sammm
Well-known member
- Location
- Manchester
Walt
Inspector Walt of the FPD
Sad to see this has turned into a minor argument of Police vs Rebels.
As CSI Neo has said, they are going to be regularly reviewing this rule and ensure that they can get it re-implemented as soon as possible but it is important that the Police is strong and stable at that point, otherwise it will simply go downhill again.
Regarding a few of the suggestions made on this -
Z3ig3r - Please do not view it as that, this decision was never made with the intention of providing some sort of "one up" on the rebels. As was stated in the original post, Police have been struggling a lot recently and lost a lot of good people. The implementation of this rule was there purely to give Police a breather and reduce some stress amongst the Police.
Jimmyy - Can completely understand the point you are making and I can see how kidnapping Officers with the intent of using them as hostages in Bank Ops is extremely beneficial. However, what you must remember is it makes bank jobs extremely hard for Police and the issue is, Bank jobs are not a major event, recently I've witnessed TKC robbing the treasury almost every hour...hats off to them for the effort and dedication, but if they had Police / Civilian hostages every time we wouldn't be able to do anything, we'd just sit there and wait. IF bank jobs were more like real life, extremely rare events that played out over a long period of time rather than some extremely common and quick event then I could see Police happily sitting back and completely ensuring hostage safety, however at the moment it happens too much so Officers are forced to move in, if not, everyone will simply get a hostage, rob the bank without a fight and then use that money to go kill people.
Major Thresh - I can completely understand your point however I feel some of your information is invalid.
15 UNMC - Good shout there, they usually don't bother Police too much so I can see why you've discounted them
20 hobos - No clue what they are doing, I'll give you that, but because of this they require so much attention. The amount of hobos that run around dribbling and killing day in and day out is too much. They becoming almost tougher than gangs, because gangs will supply them weapons, they'll go ape shit shooting everyone and then run, we then have to indentify actual civilians from armed hobos waiting for the right moment to shoot us.
20 who run around and RP - Another great shout, however you must realise about 80% - 90% of these are getting robbed / kidnapped / killed by rebels and requesting assistance from Police to which we respond to.
40 rebels - Another valid shout, but you are wrong when saying they are against 25 Police. They are against very few at once because of all the other shit going on around Altis. Also, please remember a lot of what Rebels do is pre-planned and usually involves a nicely sized team ..4 + atleast. Most Police travel in teams of 2 unless stuff is called in, so usually Police are outgunned until backup arrives.
Regarding your quantity rather than quality argument all I can say is the Police is between a rock and a hard place. Yesterday myself, SI Bob and some other great Officers spent around an hour having a Q + A session in Kavala HQ with protesting citizens. We can't answer their calls, so they want MORE police, so the Police has a massive recruitment drive, obviously quality is going to fall because less time can be spent training up each Officer individually. What you must remember is that the Police is trying it's best to get both the quality and the quantity there but it takes time. If you feel there are Officers who shouldn't be Cops, get evidence to support your beliefs and show it to senior Officers. It will be dealt with accordingly.
Stee - I wouldn't call MK20s overpowered myself, it depends on the situation. At long range they're fairly shit because they're non lethal, and if you can't detain that suspect because they are being covered by team mates, it makes actually dealing with those threats quite hard. Close quarters, yes, I can completely understand why you'd have a hard time with them.
Puppy - We can't get more AR. AR is a specialised unit made up of the best shooters the Police has. Having more in reduces quality and they are not supposed to be a big unit. They respond to assist the regular Police when Operations take a turn for the worst and stuff like that. Regarding your idea to reduce the amount of Hobos I think that's fantastic bud. Personally I'd like to see this server fully whitelisted so people have to actually put effort into getting in the server. We've got the quantity of people on this server, now we should be looking at quality. Sadly though, we have people spawning, being given weapons and going round being silly....ah well.
As CSI Neo has said, they are going to be regularly reviewing this rule and ensure that they can get it re-implemented as soon as possible but it is important that the Police is strong and stable at that point, otherwise it will simply go downhill again.
Regarding a few of the suggestions made on this -
Z3ig3r - Please do not view it as that, this decision was never made with the intention of providing some sort of "one up" on the rebels. As was stated in the original post, Police have been struggling a lot recently and lost a lot of good people. The implementation of this rule was there purely to give Police a breather and reduce some stress amongst the Police.
Jimmyy - Can completely understand the point you are making and I can see how kidnapping Officers with the intent of using them as hostages in Bank Ops is extremely beneficial. However, what you must remember is it makes bank jobs extremely hard for Police and the issue is, Bank jobs are not a major event, recently I've witnessed TKC robbing the treasury almost every hour...hats off to them for the effort and dedication, but if they had Police / Civilian hostages every time we wouldn't be able to do anything, we'd just sit there and wait. IF bank jobs were more like real life, extremely rare events that played out over a long period of time rather than some extremely common and quick event then I could see Police happily sitting back and completely ensuring hostage safety, however at the moment it happens too much so Officers are forced to move in, if not, everyone will simply get a hostage, rob the bank without a fight and then use that money to go kill people.
Major Thresh - I can completely understand your point however I feel some of your information is invalid.
15 UNMC - Good shout there, they usually don't bother Police too much so I can see why you've discounted them
20 hobos - No clue what they are doing, I'll give you that, but because of this they require so much attention. The amount of hobos that run around dribbling and killing day in and day out is too much. They becoming almost tougher than gangs, because gangs will supply them weapons, they'll go ape shit shooting everyone and then run, we then have to indentify actual civilians from armed hobos waiting for the right moment to shoot us.
20 who run around and RP - Another great shout, however you must realise about 80% - 90% of these are getting robbed / kidnapped / killed by rebels and requesting assistance from Police to which we respond to.
40 rebels - Another valid shout, but you are wrong when saying they are against 25 Police. They are against very few at once because of all the other shit going on around Altis. Also, please remember a lot of what Rebels do is pre-planned and usually involves a nicely sized team ..4 + atleast. Most Police travel in teams of 2 unless stuff is called in, so usually Police are outgunned until backup arrives.
Regarding your quantity rather than quality argument all I can say is the Police is between a rock and a hard place. Yesterday myself, SI Bob and some other great Officers spent around an hour having a Q + A session in Kavala HQ with protesting citizens. We can't answer their calls, so they want MORE police, so the Police has a massive recruitment drive, obviously quality is going to fall because less time can be spent training up each Officer individually. What you must remember is that the Police is trying it's best to get both the quality and the quantity there but it takes time. If you feel there are Officers who shouldn't be Cops, get evidence to support your beliefs and show it to senior Officers. It will be dealt with accordingly.
Stee - I wouldn't call MK20s overpowered myself, it depends on the situation. At long range they're fairly shit because they're non lethal, and if you can't detain that suspect because they are being covered by team mates, it makes actually dealing with those threats quite hard. Close quarters, yes, I can completely understand why you'd have a hard time with them.
Puppy - We can't get more AR. AR is a specialised unit made up of the best shooters the Police has. Having more in reduces quality and they are not supposed to be a big unit. They respond to assist the regular Police when Operations take a turn for the worst and stuff like that. Regarding your idea to reduce the amount of Hobos I think that's fantastic bud. Personally I'd like to see this server fully whitelisted so people have to actually put effort into getting in the server. We've got the quantity of people on this server, now we should be looking at quality. Sadly though, we have people spawning, being given weapons and going round being silly....ah well.
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Jimmyy
Well-known member
- Location
- Weston-Super-Mare
This is the beauty of RP, the cops can use different scenarios each time. Whether they are offering the rebels 1/4 of the gold in return for the hostages and no shootout. Or if they can wait for the hostages to be released then send in cars. One main trait of good RP is being able to value your life over goods/items. The police need to value the hostages life. I'm sure some of the more clever officers could come up with methods to get hostages back and some gold.
Walt
Inspector Walt of the FPD
I completely understand the points you are making. What I'm trying to say is that sometimes a Bank OP would need to occur whereby the Rebels were unable to get any gold, simply in an attempt to discourage it happening as much.
My concern and reason for attempting to suggest why Officers may move in on a bank where hostages are present is that if hostages = guaranteed gold, it will continue to happen and more and more will attempt it. Please note my comments weren't in any way a complaint and I am aware of the numerous RP routes that are available even when hostages are involved, I'm just trying to help explain one of the reasons as to why having Police taken was removed.
My concern and reason for attempting to suggest why Officers may move in on a bank where hostages are present is that if hostages = guaranteed gold, it will continue to happen and more and more will attempt it. Please note my comments weren't in any way a complaint and I am aware of the numerous RP routes that are available even when hostages are involved, I'm just trying to help explain one of the reasons as to why having Police taken was removed.
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Mercenary Thresh
Well-known member
- Location
- Lund, Scania, Sweden.
I thank you for your great answer.
Aye, I am very much aware of the fact that there's always a lot of things for the police force to take care of. However, think about real life?
Think about it guys.. Seriously.
A contry that was just the center of a fight between to contries plus NATO.. Now there's nothing left but a police force and some rebels? Ofcourse there will be tons of things for the police to take care of, especially when it comes to being outnumbered and outgunned.
I also have to point out that I've started doing that already. Videotaping police who are seemlingy too high ranked for their own good or in general just shouldnt be a cop in my opinion.
I can give you some solid examples of when I feel that taking a police hostage should be allowed, and why.
Note that all of these examples actually have happened. Both of them less than a week ago if I'm not misstaken.
Example 1.
I'm a squad leader in the national guard in Sweden. I'm the leader of a squad of total 8 soldiers, myself included. Our job is to hide, seek, hide, destroy, hide.
I had my gang, Sierra - Nordic Battle Group co
perating with EXP, where as I took command of all the players. We were 17 players.
I split us all into small teams of two, spreading us around for maximum cover, firepower, visual sight and safety.
I made sure we had the two best shots in our group was far far away at a position with sniper rifles where they could provide intel and support all around.
In other words, it was just like real soldiers would set up in real life, with a real military leader.
Up comes a police SUV. I run out of cover and scream "Stop your veichle or you'll be fired upon!".
The SUV slows down, turns away and tries to make a run for it.
We all open fire, fully automatic as I commanded.
Within 2 seconds, he lost all of his weels and the veichle was already not looking too well.
The police officer jumps out and starts to shoot back. He dies the very same second as I command "take him out" after I got the report of him shooting. Three seconds later, his car explodes due to the firepower we had.
I would much rather take the officer hostage, get some intel off him, make him drop his berret and gun and then make him run away into the sunset than shoot him down.
Gunning a police officer down makes you get a bounty.
Taking one hostage and squish him on intel and tokens then letting him run away does not give you a bounty.
Example two.
I drive a Tempest covered truck down the highway at the airfield.
A police veichle closes up quite quickly and has the blue lights on. I slow down to let him pass because I didnt do anything wrong so I didn't think that the police was after me. However the car stops on the left hand side of the road, a little bit ahead of me and a police officer jumps out screaming get out of the veichle.
I realize that I had a 400 000 bounty and I thought "oh shiet, really?".
I stop my truck, turn off the engine and I jump out.
The very same second I jump out, I get rubber bullets shot my way and nocked out straight off.
Here comes the funny thing.
The police officer did not seem to realize that the back of my truck was filled with armed rebels who simply just jumped out and sprayed him to death, looted him off his spikestrips and then we carried on. This was the same team that I spoke of in example one but with a little bit less.
We were about 10-12 people.
My one and only post as I know this isn't the place for this, maybe you didn't remember but brat wasn't the only hostage, we had five others, and as soon as you rubber bulleted all of us, each and everyone of them met their demise. It was really crappy RP we got from the police that day, but there could be many reasons for that and I dont want to start arguing with people. Sorry as this post doesn't belong in this forum but it was rather terrible event. But oh well, Its in the past.
Good to know I can still Ziptie pesky officers if I need to.
-Sauce
Grey Ghost
Active member
I once took someone hostage couple of month back, it was a 3 hour long negotiation, after the whole thing i asked negotiater if the police had ever even considered paying the 250k we asked for, and they did not.
I am now an officer myself or well only CSO (blueberry), but i would definately make some interresting RP if i once become the negotiater. ohh and another option than just taking there weapons and leave them, Just knee cap them and have them crawl back to kavala.
I am now an officer myself or well only CSO (blueberry), but i would definately make some interresting RP if i once become the negotiater. ohh and another option than just taking there weapons and leave them, Just knee cap them and have them crawl back to kavala.
Maratek
Grand Inquisitor
- Location
- Widnes
All i get from these Little Stories is you Want to use overwhelming forces in Amubushes against officers whom are only doing there job?I thank you for your great answer.
Aye, I am very much aware of the fact that there's always a lot of things for the police force to take care of. However, think about real life?
Think about it guys.. Seriously.
A contry that was just the center of a fight between to contries plus NATO.. Now there's nothing left but a police force and some rebels? Ofcourse there will be tons of things for the police to take care of, especially when it comes to being outnumbered and outgunned.
I also have to point out that I've started doing that already. Videotaping police who are seemlingy too high ranked for their own good or in general just shouldnt be a cop in my opinion.
I can give you some solid examples of when I feel that taking a police hostage should be allowed, and why.
Note that all of these examples actually have happened. Both of them less than a week ago if I'm not misstaken.
Example 1.
I'm a squad leader in the national guard in Sweden. I'm the leader of a squad of total 8 soldiers, myself included. Our job is to hide, seek, hide, destroy, hide.
I had my gang, Sierra - Nordic Battle Group co
We were 17 players.
I split us all into small teams of two, spreading us around for maximum cover, firepower, visual sight and safety.
I made sure we had the two best shots in our group was far far away at a position with sniper rifles where they could provide intel and support all around.
In other words, it was just like real soldiers would set up in real life, with a real military leader.
Up comes a police SUV. I run out of cover and scream "Stop your veichle or you'll be fired upon!".
The SUV slows down, turns away and tries to make a run for it.
We all open fire, fully automatic as I commanded.
Within 2 seconds, he lost all of his weels and the veichle was already not looking too well.
The police officer jumps out and starts to shoot back. He dies the very same second as I command "take him out" after I got the report of him shooting. Three seconds later, his car explodes due to the firepower we had.
I would much rather take the officer hostage, get some intel off him, make him drop his berret and gun and then make him run away into the sunset than shoot him down.
Gunning a police officer down makes you get a bounty.
Taking one hostage and squish him on intel and tokens then letting him run away does not give you a bounty.
Example two.
I drive a Tempest covered truck down the highway at the airfield.
A police veichle closes up quite quickly and has the blue lights on. I slow down to let him pass because I didnt do anything wrong so I didn't think that the police was after me. However the car stops on the left hand side of the road, a little bit ahead of me and a police officer jumps out screaming get out of the veichle.
I realize that I had a 400 000 bounty and I thought "oh shiet, really?".
I stop my truck, turn off the engine and I jump out.
The very same second I jump out, I get rubber bullets shot my way and nocked out straight off.
Here comes the funny thing.
The police officer did not seem to realize that the back of my truck was filled with armed rebels who simply just jumped out and sprayed him to death, looted him off his spikestrips and then we carried on. This was the same team that I spoke of in example one but with a little bit less.
We were about 10-12 people.
Are you afraid to Try some a real engagement and all you can do is deal with one police officer at a time? or are you just a coward to take on a Proper engagement of which you will lose men,
Or do then i sit on these very same forums listening to complaints police are to overpowered when we decide to have a show of force, But fine i look forward to seeing you ingame, See how you fair against officers whom have been around a Damn sight longer than any armed rebellion you pretend to be and will deal with such,
Its easy to shoot a Pc on his own pulling traffic stops, Next time lets see what happens if you see me and the cadre of senior officers i Keep for just these things.
Maratek
fisher
Banned
PeachMaster
Destroyer of Apples
- Location
- Sweden
Are these stories or complaints? Otherwise wrong forum ! Hehe...
- Status